Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

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DrLeonard
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by DrLeonard »

I am attempting to follow Dean's instructions but without success so far. Here were my steps:

(1) I made a test file of an orchestral score and cleared the instruments by selecting "None."
(2) I went to the Flute track and selected "Software Instrument" and then "Kontakt." But I had to select "General MIDI/Flute" to leave the screen.
(3) I then came back to the Flute track and went to "Choose Track's Instrument." In order to get "Woodwinds/Solo/Flute I" I then had to select the Amadeus Symphonic Orchestra dropdown, or else the instrument list from the left side of the Kontakt screen, because Solo is not an option in the Sample Libraries folder listing.
(4) I then went to the Piccolo track and chose "Existing Instrument/Kontakt/General MIDI/Flute" because that was what I had selected to set up the Flute track.
(5) I then went back to the Piccolo track "Show Track's Instrument" and pulled Piccolo from the list on the left side and assigned it to channel 2.
(6) I then went to the Oboe track and made the same choice, "Existing Instrument/GeneralMIDI/Flute."
(7) I went back to the Oboe track "Show Track's Instrument" and pulled "Oboe I" from the list on the left side and assigned it to channel 3.

However, I then found that the Piccolo track was set to Oboe instead. If I changed to Piccolo back to Piccolo, the Oboe also became a Piccolo. I don't seem to be able to set each track to its proper instrument by this "Existing Instrument" method. I can only do it by picking "Software Instrument" each time and using the Amadeus selections, as before.

Maybe I am missing something here.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by PeteFine »

I don't understand Step 2. When you start with Choose Track's Instrument/Software Instrument/Kontakt you are given a "Library" field underneath where it now says Kontakt where you can choose the library you are using (in this case you choose Amadeus Symphonic Orchestra.) There is no need to choose General Midi. Then you select your Flute from the menus below. After that you select Existing Instrument / Flute to add new tracks (instruments) to that instance of Kontakt, which will be added in correct Midi Channel sequence and you just have to make sure the channels in Inspector matches those. Are you saying that the "Library" field only shows General Midi?
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by Robert »

I've made a short video about adding an second instrument on the same instance of Kontakt. This is the way I use it. Don't forget that the new instrument will be on the following channel which is 2 in this case. It's always better to have individual instances of virtual instruments to get full control when using the audio mixer. Use of existing instruments is practical when having multiple voices on a single track for example. Hope that helps.
[youtube]https://youtu.be/kLS803mcyoQ[/youtube]
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by Bill Reed »

Robert, your link doesn't work...

There's a very simple way to do this:

Open your score
switch to the Library Panel on the left
Choose Software instrument / Kontakt
In the Library dropdown choose Amadeus
Expand the Woodwinds (as and example)
Drag Flute I and drop in onto the flute staff in your score
Bingo, the flute is all setup
Repeat for all the other instruments
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DrLeonard
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by DrLeonard »

Bill Reed wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 5:37 pm Open your score
switch to the Library Panel on the left
Choose Software instrument / Kontakt
In the Library dropdown choose Amadeus
Expand the Woodwinds (as and example)
Drag Flute I and drop in onto the flute staff in your score
Bill, in my system Kontakt and Amadeus Symphonic Orchestra are already pre-selected under "Choose Track's Instrument/Software Instrument." It's the only sample library I use (except occasionally pulling in some instrument from General MIDI that ASO doesn't have, e.g. saxophone if composing a march). So I have never had to use the Library Panel.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by DrLeonard »

PeteFine wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 8:47 am I don't understand Step 2. When you start with Choose Track's Instrument/Software Instrument/Kontakt you are given a "Library" field underneath where it now says Kontakt where you can choose the library you are using (in this case you choose Amadeus Symphonic Orchestra.) There is no need to choose General Midi. Then you select your Flute from the menus below. After that you select Existing Instrument / Flute to add new tracks (instruments) to that instance of Kontakt, which will be added in correct Midi Channel sequence and you just have to make sure the channels in Inspector matches those. Are you saying that the "Library" field only shows General Midi?
Pete, no I am not saying that. In my system, normally I would never pick General MIDI (the default choice) but would go to "Software Instrument," where Kontakt/ASO is my only choice. Then I would pick the Flute I - Solo as the instrument for the top staff. Then, ordinarily, I would repeat the process, choosing "Software Instrument," for Piccolo -Solo on the second staff, and so forth.
But I find that if I have selected Flute I - Solo for the first staff, and then go to the Piccolo track, there is no option in the "Existing Instrument/Kontakt" dropdown for "Flute I - Solo," only for "Flute I" straight. If I select that, OK. But then if I go to "Show Track's Instrument" and drag the solo Piccolo from the list in the left panel into the right panel, the Flute in Track 1 also becomes a Piccolo.
Whenever I go to "Show Track's Instrument" in a score, all the Amadeus samples are listed in the left panel. But if I have used "Existing Instrument," whatever I drag from there to the right panel changes the other instruments. The only way I can seem to get the right instruments onto a staff is to go to "Choose Track's Instrument" and select from "Software Instrument," which is always Kontakt/ASO. That works fine, but it was suggested earlier that I might want to arrange the instrumental groups (Winds, Strings, etc.) each in to one instance of Kontakt, instead of having an instance for each of the tracks, so I would have four or five instances instead of 18. But maybe it is not the case that each instrument is in its own instance; maybe the entire orchestra is in the same instance, which might be a problem in itself.
It would be helpful if the developer could chime in here to answer this question because I can't seem to figure it out; everything in "Remap Playback" has Kontakt on every line, but I have no way of telling if each line is a separate instance.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by Dean Krommydas »

Dr. Leonard...the step-by-step I gave you was based only on loading and using the existing project you gave us to work with, it won't work otherwise. I am attaching the file you gave again here for what it is worth:

Distortion_Sample.ovex
(1.3 MiB) Downloaded 14 times

Please PM me on the side if this last-ditch effort does not help you and you want to make your existing project work and ensure that the troubleshooting is completed properly from start to finish, step by step with no diversions.

Everyone else is trying to help and show you how easy it is to set up tracks, which it is...but it's all getting mixed up again.

Based on what you have said here and from the very beginning, it is very likely you have multiple individual instances of KONTAKT loaded. I can't confirm it or not yet with 100% certainty, but I believe you are confusing instances of KONTAKT, and when you see the Existing Instrument's name as being 'Flute" you think it's wrong to share it on the Piccolo track. It's not. You have to choose it even though it says Flute, and just use it on the PIccolo line and every other line.

Another way to put it is... if you want the same (one) instance of KONTAKT that you loaded for your Flute track to be used on the Piccolo track, and the Oboe track, and the Clarinet track, and the Bass Clarinet track...in order to do so...you have to use the Existing Instrument named "Flute" for all of them. Just because the Existing Instrument's name is "Flute" doesn't mean you don't or can't use it on the PIccolo, Oboe, Clarinet, and Bass Clarinet tracks. Hell, you could use it on a Trombone track... the Existing Instrument has just been given the name "Flute" based on the first track you assigned it to. If you named your first track "Dr. Leonard" the instance of KONTAKT under Existing Instrument would be named "Dr. Leonard" under the existing instrument dropdown. But it's not, it just happens to be called Flute, because that is the first track name it has been assigned to.

Maybe I'm wrong and you're not confusing this but either way, the steps I outlined for you should work for your pre-existing project but you can't divert or do anything different. PM me if you are still having an issue.

If you want to do something else along the lines of what everyone else is trying to point out to you...just do the simplest test and keep your existing project out of it. Set up a brand new project with two tracks, two treble, or two bass clefs (NOT A GRAND STAFF). From there, follow the directions that have been outlined for you. Why not...one more time...

Right-click on the first track > select choose the first track's instrument > select Software Instument Tab > KONTAKT > load an instrument inside of it.
Go to the second track > right-click on it > select choose track's instrument > select Existing Instrument tab > select the only available item with the "First Track's Name" in the Existing Instrument dropdown.
Return to the second track > right-click > select Show Track's Instrument
KONTAKT should show up with the instrument you loaded for the first track. Now, load another instrument into KONTAKT- make sure it's set to channel two, return to track 2 inside of Overture, and open the track inspector for track 2. Make sure the channel is set to channel 2. You should have independent sound for both within the same instance of KONTAKT.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by DrLeonard »

OK, I think I see where I went wrong. When I chose the instrument for the second track (Piccolo, although it's called "Flute 1") I dragged the ASO sample from the left panel into the right panel, which changed the Flute in track 1 to Piccolo. Instead, if I clicked the Piccolo sample it went into the right panel as a second instrument below the Flute, but it sounds like the Piccolo on playback. Again, if I chose Flute I for the Oboe track and then clicked on the Oboe sample in the left panel it went into the right panel as a third instrument below the Piccolo, but sounds like the Oboe. So every "Show Track's Instrument" is showing all instruments loaded for that instance, but only the sample I clicked on in the left panel is playing (and has been assigned the next channel in both Kontakt and the Inspector). But then if I click the instrument I want to show in the list under "Instrument Navigator" in the left panel, that instrument slides to the top of the right window -- but the others are still there, and if I close the window and open it again the Flute is at the top as before although the track sounds for instrument I want. (Is that the way it's supposed to be, or is there a way to suppress the view of the instruments I don't want to sound in this track?)

My mistake was to drag the second, third, etc. instruments into their Kontakt right panel (instead of clicking on them), which canceled the original instrument I was using as the base for this instance of Kontakt. Do you think I have it right this time, and are there any further suggestions? I will proceed to create the other groupings and also change the names in the Inspector to reflect the instrument that is playing on each track.
Last edited by DrLeonard on Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by Dean Krommydas »

You're close!!

You should just be clear and feel comfortable when you're working within KONTAKT and loading an instrument inside of KONTAKT and then setting up that instance(s) of KONTAKT on the tracks you want to use within Overture.

In any case yes, within KONTAKT, if you drag an instrument from the left on top of one of the instruments that you have already loaded into KONTAKT, it will replace it. So if you are going to drag, try to drag into the blank area below any instruments, not on top of an instrument that is already there. Or just simply double-click to load whatever instrument, which is what I tried to mention in the step-by-step.

From there you make sure you match up your channels in Overture's Track Inspector for the track.

I'd practice simply with two tracks from scratch, then add a third and 4th to make sure you've got it, and/or return to the step-by-step using your existing project to make sure you're good there.

Either way, you're close and it's always good to start again from the beginning.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by PeteFine »

Sounds like progress is being made. I have to just chime in something I posted about years ago- that the choice of naming "instances" or referring to the sound Library being used as an "instrument" is confusing a s Hell and has accounted for many bewildered posts on this Forum. At first I was one of them. We all think of an "instrument" as being a musical instrument!! A Flute, a Tuba, a violin.... Yet it is inappropriately used to describe an entire library/ VST/ sound source.
That may or may not have contributed to this issue but it really should be changed.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by DrLeonard »

I was successful in converting an orchestral score (not the one I started this thread with) to four instances of Kontakt (from 18, I assume). It was a test file so I could compare it with the original. Of course I had to rename the tracks, restore clefs (bass clef, viola clef), and restore playback pitches (e.g., trumpet -2, horn -7. bass clarinet -14, etc.) because I write a transposed score. Unfortunately this effort did not do anything for the playback sound compared with the original and, in fact, there are some problems (for example I can't seem to regulate the volume of the tuba, it is much too loud). So I am not sure I have accomplished anything with this exercise.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by Dean Krommydas »

Hi Dr. Leonard,

I have moved this topic to the "How Do I" section of the forum.

For the sake of keeping the topic on point, if you are looking for feedback on your latest findings and concerns of renaming, restoring, and exploring the conversion of an orchestral score and your tuba volume regulation issue, please start a new thread on that.
DrLeonard wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:43 pm I am not sure I have accomplished anything with this exercise.
Well...to be fair you have touched upon more than one exercise.
DrLeonard wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:43 pm I was successful in converting an orchestral score (not the one I started this thread with) to four instances of Kontakt (from 18, I assume).
For this thread at least, learning how to load instruments into KONTAKT, consolidate and share multiple instances of KONTAKT, and share those instances of KONTAKT on any given track within Overture whether in your existing project or in a new one...is at least something.

You should eventually be able to take that knowledge and adapt it to the existing score you started this topic with. Either way, you're on the right track and you are welcome to PM me for direct help with this and your stuttering issue which you were right at the end of identifying.
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Re: Adding Another Instrument to Instance of Kontakt

Post by DrLeonard »

[/quote]
Dean Krommydas wrote: Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:37 am I have moved this topic to the "How Do I" section of the forum.
Thanks, Dean. Yes, of course this is the right thread for this topic, after all. Being the novice that I am, I am not always sure where topics belong!
DrLeonard wrote: Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:43 pm learning how to load instruments into KONTAKT, consolidate and share multiple instances of KONTAKT, and share those instances of KONTAKT on any given track within Overture whether in your existing project or in a new one...is at least something.
Yes, I am sure the ability I acquired will be useful in the future. Thanks to everyone for your help.
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